SysEx messages all mapping to ctrl 85

[azslow3]

Lets try with all Solos (Select is NOT yet there), you need b337

Check either Solo are working in both directions. Tip: in the sonar set 12 solos as On/Off/On/Off/... and then move WAI one strip right, check the result, one strip left, check the result.
Last 2 strips are solo for 2 WAI buses (so, corresponding to current  fader definitions). Return solos are not processed (yet).

To be consistent, with all solos OFF, press Return 1/2 solo and check (with MIDIOX) which Solo mode it is sending when On/Off. I mean "61 00 0a 05" or "61 00 0a 0d" (or not at all). In other words,
does Return solo also influence this magic "Solo Mode" (for whatever it is good for Y01, even in case we do not observe anything out of it, I prefer to follow Y01 rules).

[Linzmeister]

All solos follow WAI perfectly
Bidirectional communication is correct.
Fader Motors have stopped updating.  I can see that MIDI is not coming in to 01V when moving faders on screen.  I checked that current software state Motor = On, read automation was on.

The RTN SOLO buttons didn't affect anything in Sonar.

Now that I think carefully about feedback of the SELect function, I think it is best to ignore it for now.  My main goal is to use the Sonar onscreen controls as little as possible, and to do all the work from the Yamaha's surface.  Let's keep the feedback as simple as we can - fader motors, knob values and status lights.  Trying to locate the SELect light out of WAI or move WAI after soloing from sonar may be counter intuitive.

RTN 1 on
61 00 10 0E
61 00 0A 0D
23 01 0E 10 00       Select RTN1   Undefined action list.

off
61 00 10 06
61 00 0A 05


RT2 On
61 00 10 0F
61 00 0A 0D
23 01 0F 10 00       Select RTN2      Undefined action list.

Off
61 00 10 07
61 00 0A 05

RTN 1 SOLO = bank left
RTN 2 SOLO = bank right
Momentary action desired from a latching control.  So, when a RTN X solo ON is received, it moves bank and turns RTN X solo off.
Set RTN SOLOs Off during finitDAWMode ??


RTN 1 Rotary Volume   
30 00 1A 00  -  7F

RTN 2 Rotary Volume
30 00 1B 00  -  7F

No motor control, but feedback would be good as it does have an LCD representation of the rtn's position.  I plan to use the returns as jog and/or shuttle controls.. later..

[Linzmeister]

Re motors...
Maybe i changed a midi setting by accident.. Will check tomorrow

[azslow3]

All solos follow WAI perfectly
Bidirectional communication is correct.

That is good.

Fader Motors have stopped updating.  I can see that MIDI is not coming in to 01V when moving faders on screen.  I checked that current software state Motor = On, read automation was on.

I have introduced a logical bug in some "advanced" tuning for faders. I hope attached test preset fix that.

The RTN SOLO buttons didn't affect anything in Sonar.

Not assigned yet...

Now that I think carefully about feedback of the SELect function, I think it is best to ignore it for now.  My main goal is to use the Sonar onscreen controls as little as possible, and to do all the work from the Yamaha's surface.  Let's keep the feedback as simple as we can - fader motors, knob values and status lights.  Trying to locate the SELect light out of WAI or move WAI after soloing from sonar may be counter intuitive.

Select is important. If I understand it right, from Y01 perspective it really select the channel. For Sonar, we are going to use it to indicate "focused" strip, for which we control pan,EQ,etc. There are 2 features/problems with that:
1) Solo also send "Select". Since for you that is desired effect, we can call it a feature.
2) Select can be moved to another channel, but I do not know how to "select nothing", in other words turn if off. That should happened when focus in Sonar is outside WAI, since in that case looking at Y01 you can "see" some strip is selected, while you are going to control completely different strip. My current proposal - "select" Return 1 as an indication that focus is moved outside WAI in Sonar.
When operating return "Solo" and "Select", I have to be careful to return the indication back to where it should be.

My plan to start configuring Select if Test9 is fine.

RTN 1 on
61 00 10 0E
61 00 0A 0D

So return solo also influence Solo "mode". Looking at picture, it can be the these "OD/05" is what controls the LED right of return select buttons (global solo?). We can even try to use it in such (helpful in case no from controlled strips are soloed, but something else in Sonar is). But not now...

RTN 1 SOLO = bank left
RTN 2 SOLO = bank right
Momentary action desired from a latching control.  So, when a RTN X solo ON is received, it moves bank and turns RTN X solo off.
Set RTN SOLOs Off during finitDAWMode ??
RTN 1 Rotary Volume   
30 00 1A 00  -  7F
RTN 2 Rotary Volume
30 00 1B 00  -  7F

The idea is good. But let us configure things "sequentially". We can started with strip controls, lets finish them first. We have faders (hopefully working again), Solo (working), Select is next for me, "On" (is that "mute?") is the next for you.

We can then continue with Return controls definitions (but I should make them not influence other operations during Select  definition). Return Solo LEDs we can use for something meaningful (like global record armed, automation write enable, "mode" of Y01 in respect to Sonar, once we continue with logic definition).

No motor control, but feedback would be good as it does have an LCD representation of the rtn's position.

Not sure some numeric value is useful for our purpose. AZ Controller has build-in "Display". If you have some place on your computer monitor(s) which you can dedicated to it (font/size/color are configurable), we can output required information (values, parameter names, current strip name, etc.). Another fancy option, in case you have iPad/Antroid phone/tablet and local wlan, is to use such device as an "extra" (touch sensitive! so be-directional) display/control... But we are far away from that at the moment 

[azslow3]

One more comment... Y01 has not many "free" buttons/knobs for non strip related operations. Depending on your financial situation, it can be helpful to add some small extra "device" into your setup, something in direction of X-Touch Mini, Korg nano-pad or any other MIDI controller for which you have physical place.

Note that with AZ Controller, any MIDI controller can be configured as an "extension" to another. F.e. you can switch "bank" (WAI), Motor Off, etc. of Y01 using buttons on that additional controller. If on budget, any joystick/gamepad also can be used for that perpose 

[azslow3]

While I was looking the documentation either there is a way SOLO buttons are not selecting channel (the only statements I have found is that the "normally do", but I have not found how to change it to "abnormal"...), I came to stupid general question: does REMOTE page 3 still work in LOCAL OFF mode? Any reason we are not using it, since it is thought to control DAW at first place, with Faders, Solo and On only, but still ?

Back to our test...

Attached preset should have "SEL" buttons defined. So, these buttons should select corresponding strip (including switching to/from buses when used on channels 13/14, 15/16). SOLO buttons should do the same in parallel with normal Solo operation. Indication should be correct when you focus strips in Sonar (my mouse) or change WAI (so relative focused strip is changes). When focused strip is outside both WAIs, RTN 2 should be "SEL"ected. RTN 1-2 SOLO/SEL buttons should not affect SEL LEDs (except for short time when you press them). Note that RTN SOLO 1-12 LEDs are not defined, so they will change Light/Dark when you press these buttons, that is ok (as I have written before, we can define what they should indicate later).

So, the next step is your bug report (I man your report about my bugs  ) and "ON" buttons SysExes.

[Linzmeister]

I thought you were going on holidays 

I don't want to keep you at this while you should be sipping cocktails by the pool, riding horses bare back, taking long walks on the beach at sunset or whatever it is that you do while taking time off.

You have given me so much to think about, but I don't want to reply just yet, because it is all for after initial hardware mapping.  I have some good ideas (I think).

Remote Banks have limited functionality..  Fader, On, Solo.. that's it!..  No EQ, no Pan, no dynamics, no Aux sends.... no good stuff

As for the Global Solo Light - I have already turned it Off by choosing:

Solo:           Disabled    -  doesn't use the GLOBAL Solo Status light, and each soloed channel LED turns on solid - no flashing..
SYSX: F0 43 10 3E 04 61 00 0A 06 F7

so the 61 00 0A 0D and 61 00 0A 05 can be ignored I think

Y01 has not many "free" buttons/knobs for non strip related operations.

As I read the AZ controller documentation, there is a means of using modifiers to change the function of controls to do more than one thing depending on modifier control status.  see attached screen grab of spread sheet to see where my thoughts are going... scary place inside here...   

[azslow3]

I thought you were going on holidays 

Yes, but not today

So we still have time to fix current setup, define "ON" and may be some "modes". Also I will have my notebook, so I can modify things (AZ Controller is my hobby, holidays is a good time to continue with it)

I don't want to keep you at this while you should be sipping cocktails by the pool, riding horses bare back, taking long walks on the beach at sunset or whatever it is that you do while taking time off.

More like traffic jams, no oxygen and vodka. Moscow 

Remote Banks have limited functionality..  Fader, On, Solo.. that's it!..  No EQ, no Pan, no dynamics, no Aux sends.... no good stuff

But that are "extra controls" (once in that mode). So we can still use that, in case available with LOCAL OFF. Especially in case you can switch there "fast" (is REMOTE button does that in one step?).
For example, for ACT Dynamic Mapping (ADM). In your "layout", you need first switch to Transport, then press ON 12 for that. Note, that it is better to have buttons in ACT mode (switch bands, switch the effect, etc), and that is not in you layout...
With "extra" Remote mode, we can get: Faders + ON are ADM controls, SOLO are switch controls (transport, move focus to next FX/PC/Synth and switch between them). Interesting either REMOTE mode bi-directional is.

Y01 has not many "free" buttons/knobs for non strip related operations.

As I read the AZ controller documentation, there is a means of using modifiers to change the function of controls to do more than one thing depending on modifier control status.  see attached screen grab of spread sheet to see where my thoughts are going... scary place inside here...   

Yes, as many modes as you want. But you should not forget to switch into correct mode 

Some comments about your table:
1) we have "SEL", "SOLO" and "ON". But your "Edit" mode has 4 rows.
2) buttons are not "momentary" since they do not sent "release", so ALT, CTRL, SHIFT in your Edit layout are not easy to use
3) "SEL" led is mutual exclusive, in Arm mode, we will be unable to indicate Rec Arm for strips

In general, I have tried to use "Edit" with my StudioMix, so with jogger and several modified (momentary!) keys in the near (I could operate just with one hand, thumb on modifiers). Technically that was perfect, but practically Sonar has too many limitations there, I mean not all operations which are simple with mouse are practical with remote.
The luck of one function is bugging me since years: there is no way to position Data cursor on predictable track. It appears in the track window vertical center, whatever track is there (or nearest). I have even tried to move 300 times "up" and then required track number down, but (invisible for Surface API) folders should be counted.

[Linzmeister]

I skipped preset 9 and went straight to 10:
1) Fader motors are working again.
2) SELect 1-12 focus on WAI track, in track view and mixer view.  I use dual monitors with both open all the time
3) SELect 13-14 Focus on WAI Bus, in track view and mixer view.
4) Clicking on track or Bus outside WAI lights RTN2 SEL button
5) SELectng RTN 1 or 2, their SEL light flickers then SEL returns to focused channel.
Beautiful work!! 

That is exactly how I was thinking about it too.  It means that I can't adjust the EQ of an unknown channel and screw something up that may have been carefully crafted..  You should become a doctor..  they take the Hippocratic oath to "Do no Harm".. you have done precisely that here... prevented me from doing harm to my tracks..


Channel on/mute buttons.  Yamaha buttons are labelled ON not MUTE and means that ON light lit is passing signal, and light unlit is silent, whereas sonar think mute light lit is silent and light unlit is passing signal ...
inverted logic. 
receive on message, turn mute off
receive off message, turn mute on

SysEx data in numerical order..

Channel OFF
1   60 01 30 00
2   60 01 30 01
3   60 01 30 02
4   60 01 30 03
5   60 01 30 04
6   60 01 30 05
7   60 01 30 06
8   60 01 30 07

CHannel 0N
1   60 01 30 08
2   60 01 30 09
3   60 01 30 0A
4   60 01 30 0B
5   60 01 30 0C
6   60 01 30 0D
7   60 01 30 0E
8   60 01 30 0F

Channel OFF
9      60 01 31 00
10      60 01 31 01
11      60 01 31 02
12      60 01 31 03
13/14   60 01 31 04
15/16   60 01 31 05
RTN1   60 01 31 06   Mode modifier  forms a binary count 00 to 11  (0-3)
RTN2   60 01 31 07   Mode modifier

Channel ON
9      60 01 31 08
10      60 01 31 09
11      60 01 31 0A
12      60 01 31 0B
13/14   60 01 31 0C
15/16   60 01 31 0D
RTN1   60 01 31 0E   Mode modifier   
RTN2   60 01 31 0F   Mode modifier


ST Out     60 01 34 07 Master OFF
ST Out     60 01 34 0F Master ON


I set up a MUTE group containing all channels 1 - 16
and got the following bulk messages:

CH 1-16 on  2 messages
60 01 30 08 09 0A 0B 0C 0D 0E 0F   channels 1 - 8
60 01 31 08 09 0A 0B 0C 0D      channels 9 - 15/16

Ch 1-16 off  2 messages
60 01 30 00 01 02 03 04 05 06 07   channels 1 - 8
60 01 31 00 01 02 03 04 05      channels 9 - 15/16



CH 17-24  Option I/O fader Mode
17   60 01 35 00
18   60 01 35 01
19   60 01 35 02
20   60 01 35 03
21   60 01 35 04
22   60 01 35 05
23   60 01 35 06
24   60 01 35 07


CH 17-24
17   60 01 35 08
18   60 01 35 09
19   60 01 35 0A
20   60 01 35 0B
21   60 01 35 0C
22   60 01 35 0D
23   60 01 35 0E
24   60 01 35 0F

Channels 17-24 can not be put into a mute group through the LCD menus.. I don't know if that impacts on bulk MIDI commands or not.  I guess we can try and see what happens - if anything.

Some comments about your table:
1) we have "SEL", "SOLO" and "ON". But your "Edit" mode has 4 rows.
2) buttons are not "momentary" since they do not sent "release", so ALT, CTRL, SHIFT in your Edit layout are not easy to use

It is only 2 in EDIT mode.  the top 2 rows are the keyboard shortcuts from the sonar documentation and the bottom rows are how I would label the desk to find the functions.. and they are labelled   SOLO ON SOLO ON  It is a work in progress - just the current state of thinking and still needs refinement. 
CTRL, ALT and SHIFT buttons are probably not being utilised properly in that layout either..  lets call that attempt 1 and I'll try again later..

3) "SEL" led is mutual exclusive, in Arm mode, we will be unable to indicate Rec Arm for strips

I was thinking quick and dirty - just turn it on with SEL and turn it off with GLOBAL off.  not elegant - true... too early to be cutting corners??

In general, I have tried to use "Edit" with my StudioMix, so with jogger and several modified (momentary!) keys in the near (I could operate just with one hand, thumb on modifiers). Technically that was perfect, but practically Sonar has too many limitations there, I mean not all operations which are simple with mouse are practical with remote.

I hear the voice of experience - thank you.  Something that seems good on paper may not actually work in the studio..  got it.  I did try some editing with the number pad on the keyboard during the last weekend.  I got lost as to which mode I was in - was I selecting, zooming, cropping, nudging or fading in/out.  exit without save...


Remote fader banks can be custom configured to include any controls..
bank 1 defaults to bus 1-4 master, aux 1-4 master, FX 1-2 master,with associated master ON on the ON button, 4 unassigned faders and buttons.
bank 2 defaults to input delay ch 1-15/16, and Input delay enable ch 1-15/16
bank 3 defaults to FX 1 parameters on faders, all ON buttons unassigned
bank 4 defaults to FX 2 parameters on faders, all ON buttons unassigned

but but you only get
1 fader and
1 button
per strip and the SELect follows last fader or the last on Button.
All 4 banks are freely editable and could contain any parameter.. faders/aux send/EQ, dynamics controls....
and no access to the RTN 1 + 2 controls


With Option I/O fader mode - PAGE 2, we have access to 8 channels 17-24 only  (instead of 14 on remote) but each channel is more feature rich.
Fader,
On/Mute,
Solo,
SELect,
Pan,
5 Bus assignment switches,
2 aux,
2 fx sends,
2 bands of parametric EQ controls (Low, high) - 6 rotaries,
EQ on/off, and
EQ Attenuator
..... per channel strip  Maybe optionI/O is a better choice for ADM ??

Pages 1 & 3 are the meters - which are not available in LOCAL OFF mode,
Page 4 is the output routing - not available in LOCAL OFF mode,
Page 5 allows us to swap 17-24 with 1-8 either globally or individually select channels to flip - not something that I will be bothering with for sonar..   1:1 nice and easy.

[azslow3]

I skipped preset 9 and went straight to 10:
...
Beautiful work!! 

That is too good to be true 

I have a bit tune Select (to process correctly an attempt to select not existing strip, f.e. if you only have 1 track in the project and try to select track 5...). But we are not done with it yet. On picture I see that ST/Master also has Select! Sorry if I have skipped some of your reports, but I can not find what it is sending... May be we can use it as the indication of "outside WAI", instead of RTN2. But we in any case should process it (to revert, the same way as for RTN).

I have implemented ON as mute. Please check. RTN1/RTN2/ST ON are not configured yet.

Channel on/mute buttons.  Yamaha buttons are labelled ON not MUTE and means that ON light lit is passing signal, and light unlit is silent, whereas sonar think mute light lit is silent and light unlit is passing signal ...
inverted logic.

Should work like that (light when not muted, no light when muted or not exist).

3) "SEL" led is mutual exclusive, in Arm mode, we will be unable to indicate Rec Arm for strips

I was thinking quick and dirty - just turn it on with SEL and turn it off with GLOBAL off.  not elegant - true... too early to be cutting corners??

That is not a problem to turn On AND Off Rec Arm with SEL button. It is just not possible to indicate which strips are Automation Record Armed with SEL LED, since there can be several. Theoretically I can find the first and indicate it, but that is not so easy and not informative. I propose keep SEL LEDs always indicate selected strip. We probably need it for Pan/Eq in any case.

In general, I have tried to use "Edit" with my StudioMix, so with jogger and several modified (momentary!) keys in the near (I could operate just with one hand, thumb on modifiers). Technically that was perfect, but practically Sonar has too many limitations there, I mean not all operations which are simple with mouse are practical with remote.

I hear the voice of experience - thank you.  Something that seems good on paper may not actually work in the studio..  got it.  I did try some editing with the number pad on the keyboard during the last weekend.  I got lost as to which mode I was in - was I selecting, zooming, cropping, nudging or fading in/out.  exit without save...

For me the result was not so bad. But my StudioMix has severe hardware problem (all encoders periodically send "Turned left" when I turn them right, faders generate movements on themselves and some messaged are periodically transferred with corrupted bits...). I may be open it, clean it, etc some lucky day. But for the moment it stays unused.

So please test current version, let me know about ST/Master SEL, and if it is ok, I will implement modes. After that we can either continue with Ch 17-24 for ADM or Pan/Eq/RTN Knobs.

[Linzmeister]

3) "SEL" led is mutual exclusive, in Arm mode, we will be unable to indicate Rec Arm for strips

I was thinking quick and dirty - just turn it on with SEL and turn it off with GLOBAL off.  not elegant - true... too early to be cutting corners??

That is not a problem to turn On AND Off Rec Arm with SEL button. It is just not possible to indicate which strips are Automation Record Armed with SEL LED, since there can be several.
.......
I propose keep SEL LEDs always indicate selected strip.

How about we use the Remote Bank 2 (Input Channel Delay on/off) to control REC Autom~n.
        Dedicated switches not required elsewhere by sonar,
        status lights and
        part of factory default mixer settings.. making it easy for other people to use when we are done..

We probably need it for Pan/Eq in any case.

True.  Follow the natural intuitive flow of the hardware

I did try some editing with the number pad on the keyboard during the last weekend.   I got lost as to which mode I was in - was I selecting, zooming, cropping, nudging or fading in/out.

I did see that the editing functions work in conjunction with Jog.  Not having any jog control at the time may have made it more difficult I suppose. 

I will test and report tonight.

[Linzmeister]

I have a bit tune Select (to process correctly an attempt to select not existing strip, f.e. if you only have 1 track in the project and try to select track 5...).

yup, deleted a bunch of tracks from test project, leaving only 8 tracks. 
The instant I deleted them, faders 9-12 went to -inf.
Could not solo or select channels 9-12.
Very nice!!

But we are not done with it yet. On picture I see that ST/Master also has Select! Sorry if I have skipped some of your reports, but I can not find what it is sending... May be we can use it as the indication of "outside WAI", instead of RTN2. But we in any case should process it (to revert, the same way as for RTN).

I suspect I omitted it.  Apologies.

SEL master
23 01 16 10 00

I have implemented ON as mute. Please check. RTN1/RTN2/ST ON are not configured yet.

yup, that works a treat on the tracks.  Something not with quite right with the busses though.

01V Channels 13/14 and 15/16 ONs both seem to be linked to WAI Buss 1 Mute.
Change 01V 13/14 ... 15/16 follows - both affect Buss 1 Mute.
Change 01V 15/16 ... 13/14 follows - both affect Buss 1 Mute.
Neither affect buss 2 mute.
Changing Sonar Buss 1 toggles both 01V 13/14 & 15/16 ONs.
Changing Buss 2 does nothing to 01V ON status.

After that we can either continue with Ch 17-24 for ADM or Pan/Eq/RTN Knobs.

I think finish off all faders, solo, On & SEL.

Option I/O fader Mode

Faders 17-24 (physically 1-8 on surface, but as soon as I change modes in without PC connected, the faders change position to match the new parameter being controlled)

30 01 XX YY
XX = 07 - 0E is channel number
YY = Volume 00 - 7F


CH 17-24   OFF
60 01 35 XX 
XX = 00 - 07


CH 17-24 ON
60 01 35 XX
XX = 08 - 0F


SEL 17-24
23 01 XX 0A 00
XX = 17 - 1E


Solo
61 00 11 [XX]
61 00 0A 0D except last one OFF which sends 0A 05 see below
SEL Message

XX = 00-07 are 17-24 off,
XX = 08-0F are 17-24 on


Aaah Haaa!!!
I just found the pattern to the second solo commands!!! 
Turning all except the last solo ON or OFF sends   61 00 0A 0D 
Turning off the last solo sends                            61 00 0A 05

So, if  you receive Last solo off, it might worth verifying that you are in sync with Yamaha by executing UNSOLO all tracks???

I wasn't imagining things or changing solo modes by accident.. Oh I am going to sleep well tonight, having found that

Something I noticed by accident:
CTRL+DBL CLICK on sonar fader (to set to unity) *all* track faders move together with respective volumes.. inside WAI and outside WAI.. all 32 tracks in my test project.
I also noticed when CTRL+CLICK on a track fader, there is an orange indicator appears near the fader volume value on all tracks.

Same thing when CTRL+Click on busses.

The main outs move independent unless a stereo pair is locked which is normal

[azslow3]

SEL master
23 01 16 10 00

I have moved "outside WAI" indicator there.

01V Channels 13/14 and 15/16 ONs both seem to be linked to WAI Buss 1 Mute.

Yes, should be corrected now... Things are more and more complicated, and since I can not really test it, you most probably will hit more and more bugs. Unavoidable, can be frustrating, but please just report them and I will fix them.

Aaah Haaa!!!
I just found the pattern to the second solo commands!!! 
Turning all except the last solo ON or OFF sends   61 00 0A 0D 
Turning off the last solo sends                            61 00 0A 05

Yup, I know. I am counting "solos" and send corresponding mode. We still do not know what it really does on Y01 side.

Something I noticed by accident:
CTRL+DBL CLICK on sonar fader (to set to unity) *all* track faders move together with respective volumes.. inside WAI and outside WAI.. all 32 tracks in my test project.
I also noticed when CTRL+CLICK on a track fader, there is an orange indicator appears near the fader volume value on all tracks.

Same thing when CTRL+Click on busses.

Usual group functionality in Sonar. "Ctrl+<action>". It works on selected group, and when nothing is selected on everything.

Ok. Next test is going to be interesting. Or not... if I have manage to break the whole configuration 

Channel buttons (On and Solo) now have 5(!) modes, can be switched used ST/Master and RTN1-2 ON buttons, LEDs should follow:
Off - Off - Off : Mute/Solo (default)
Off - Off - ON : Record Arm / Input echo. Note that Record Arm is not working correctly for Instrument Tracks (Sonar bug). Automatic Input Echo is not indicated for MIDI tracks (indicated as off).
Off - ON - Off : Transport. As in your table, but without: Rec. Auto.n, Touch follow (do not know for what these was thought), ACT (not useful here). Transport, strip mode, loop, scrub and punch should have correct LEDs (following Sonar)
Off - ON - ON : Edit. Not defined yet
ON - Off - Off : Read Automation / Write Automation. Should be with correct LEDs.

Master ON switch to Automation mode from any other, RTN ONs turn Master ON off. So only one button press is required to switch from Transport to Automation and back. But 2 buttons required to switch Transport to Record Arm. May be we should disable Edit mode (or move switching it to something else), than switching between other modes will be strait forward.

[Linzmeister]

Oh, WOW... That is so good!!

01V Channels 13/14 and 15/16 ONs both seem to be linked to WAI Buss 1 Mute.

Yes, should be corrected now... Things are more and more complicated, and since I can not really test it, you most probably will hit more and more bugs. Unavoidable, can be frustrating, but please just report them and I will fix them.

yup, all fixed.  Not at all frustrating.  My day job is Tech Support, Training and Product Development for ROM based Cash Registers, and I rely on the factory in Korea to write firmware code and test it here.  Very similar process... except they manufacture the hardware platform, have them in stock and obviously don't test the code they write... and I can wait months for a new version, only to find they have made a colossal error in understanding the basic problem, let alone any possible solution. 

You are doing fine!!  With no access to the hardware under test, you obviously understand the problem better than I do, and new versions are within hours or a couple of days at most.  You have my highest respect and I understand many of the difficulties you face in this remote environment.

Ok. Next test is going to be interesting. Or not... if I have manage to break the whole configuration 

Channel buttons (On and Solo) now have 5(!) modes, can be switched used ST/Master and RTN1-2 ON buttons, LEDs should follow:

nope, fear not... nothing broken at all.  I have full control over mute, solo, REC arm, Input monitor, Read Auto, and write auto.

hmm, 3 buttons - eight combinations..    I can count to 7 in binary 
But I do definitely like the simple approach too, which makes for a much faster operation..

Off - ON - Off : Transport. As in your table, but without: Rec. Auto.n, Touch follow (do not know for what these was thought), ACT (not useful here). Transport, strip mode, loop, scrub and punch should have correct LEDs (following Sonar)

Rec Auto was there because the previous CS plugin I had used a button with that name..  It doesn't appear to be required here.
I was thinking that the Touch/Follow Automation Off button would cover the overwriting automation with mouse/iPad/ other control idea you mentioned..  I may have misunderstood your line of thinking in this department.

I have realised that we could save a button by putting TRACKS and BUSSES onto a single button.  ON is one mode, OFF is the other...  I have not yet revised the button assignments and have no idea what I would put in it's place.

Scrub is not something that I have used a lot in the past.  I am not sure if it is not working correctly, or if I am using it wrong.  I have switched to a current mix project to test the transport buttons thoroughly.  When I press the scrub button on 01V, I see the audio engine light in the transport toolbar turns on, but when I press the J button on the keyboard, the mouse cursor changes to include a speaker icon and I can click and drag to scrub an individual track or the entire mix depending on the mouse vertical position on screen.

The sonar help files says to scrub press J and move mouse over a track or the timeline ruler. 
The V Studio 700 manual  says once scrub mode is activated, use jog and shuttle to listen..
How should scrubbing be done with your plugin? 
Are other controls required that are not yet defined?
Can I scrub an individual track and/or the entire mix?

Off - ON - ON : Edit. Not defined yet
....
May be we should disable Edit mode (or move switching it to something else), than switching between other modes will be strait forward.

I always find editing to be a slow and painful job - and that may be because it is precisely that.  Of course up until now I have had to use keyboard and mouse, but probably not used them well - by not researching the built in keyboard shortcuts and relied too heavily on the mouse and the tools toolbar to change from splitting to cropping to fading in/out.  I would like to see if using a control surface makes it any easier.

Most of my mixes are live show recordings - up to 2.5 hours long ... multiple songs per project - mixed down in the order they were recorded.  All audio, no MIDI, cutting out spoken word in between live songs, splitting up to 48 tracks at the same point, cropping & fading in each track, splitting, cropping, fading out.  I am still discovering the workflow benefits that a CS can truly provide.  I do some studio sessions too with a single song per project.

It might be useful to duplicate the scrub function onto the EDIT mode buttons.. and operate with jog/shutttle?  As mentioned a couple of days ago, the edit mode buttons need revising.  Is there some recommendation that you would make about frequently used tasks given my process and source material?   

[azslow3]

You are doing fine!!  With no access to the hardware under test, you obviously understand the problem better than I do, and new versions are within hours or a couple of days at most.  You have my highest respect and I understand many of the difficulties you face in this remote environment.

That is promising. As you can find in some other threads, some people give up after a while once there see something does not work right now.

hmm, 3 buttons - eight combinations..    I can count to 7 in binary 
But I do definitely like the simple approach too, which makes for a much faster operation..

As with computer keyboard, if you can do something by one key, that is perfect. Ctrl+Key OR Shift+Key OR Alt+Key is still fine. Ctlr+Shift+Key... well, still work when that something is not repeatable operation. But Y01 does not have momentary keys, so we have like "NumLock"+"CapsLock" only. To make something not annoying, we should try to avoid routine operations for which you will need to use 2 switches. For example, to overwrite some automation, with current layout you need:
a) press ST ON (automation mode)
b) disable read automation (ON on that channel) and enable write automation (SOLO on that channel)
c) press RTN1 ON for transport mode
d) press "Play" and record the automation with fader, press "Stop"
e) again switch to Automation mode, to adjust automation read/write.
We have already "disable all automation writes", we can add "enable all automation reads" there, in transport. Other approach is to add transport buttons into automation mode, for example on SEL buttons.
But depending what you do more, switch banks or play/pause, may be we should use RTN1-2 SOLO. Up to you (I have not defined these buttons yet).

I was thinking that the Touch/Follow Automation Off button would cover the overwriting automation with mouse/iPad/ other control idea you mentioned..  I may have misunderstood your line of thinking in this department.

That time I was hoping some buttons can me momentary... That is as I use that: press corresponding button as an indication the control is "touched", overwrite automation with control, release the button. For that to work, we need per fader button. F.e. we can sacrifice "automation read" for that. Other approach is to use Automation read and Overwrite automation mode. Instead of Automation read, we can use "global motor off"... Decisions, decision 

I have realised that we could save a button by putting TRACKS and BUSSES onto a single button.  ON is one mode, OFF is the other...  I have not yet revised the button assignments and have no idea what I would put in it's place.

It can be that you will be able to assign buttons yourself... Not more difficult than changing keyboard shortcuts in Sonar, at least for simple operations and without LED feedback.

Scrub is not something that I have used a lot in the past.

Scrub idea is simple: when this mode is on, in case you move "Now" time, using mouse or jog wheel, instead of jumping to new time Sonar start play to this time. Also reversed.
In practice, for most users (including myself) that feature stuck audio quick or does not work at all (with Softsynth). And without jogger... I do not know.

I always find editing to be a slow and painful job - and that may be because it is precisely that.  Of course up until now I have had to use keyboard and mouse, but probably not used them well - by not researching the built in keyboard shortcuts and relied too heavily on the mouse and the tools toolbar to change from splitting to cropping to fading in/out.  I would like to see if using a control surface makes it any easier.

Most of my mixes are live show recordings - up to 2.5 hours long ... multiple songs per project - mixed down in the order they were recorded.  All audio, no MIDI, cutting out spoken word in between live songs, splitting up to 48 tracks at the same point, cropping & fading in each track, splitting, cropping, fading out.  I am still discovering the workflow benefits that a CS can truly provide.  I do some studio sessions too with a single song per project.

It might be useful to duplicate the scrub function onto the EDIT mode buttons.. and operate with jog/shutttle?  As mentioned a couple of days ago, the edit mode buttons need revising.  Is there some recommendation that you would make about frequently used tasks given my process and source material?

I do not have any professional experience with editing/mixing, not even close. My practical application for surfaces is live jamming with myself (home hobby), when I want rec/play, change synth parameters, adjust volume of other tracks. It happens that my DP, MIDI keyboards, (e- and acoustic) guitar, e-drums, mic are not even in the same room. And in each room, the instruments are quite away from computers. That was the reason I have developed AZ Controller. I have thought to adopt cheap devices (including Joystic) to do several simple but sometimes tricky operations. CW plug-ins was not allowing me to do what I want (without "remote control" since assigned remotes interfere with MIDI). And once I have got MPK mini, I decide that I want "feedback" (from LEDs under pads).

Just to understand how all that works, I have learned what Mackie Control does and how other devices are used. I have never seen any console in real life... I have bought used StudioMix just to touch motor faders, to understand what all that about.

My profession is Control Systems, DBs, with experience in automatic/half automatic control and monitoring, including quick reaction situations and routine financial operations. That is why I periodically suggest buttons layouts and function assignments, extrapolating the background how to avoid an operator turn something wrong once there is an "alarm" to what a musician can unexpectedly change in the track... But I guess a neighbor cat can give you better advise on mixing/editing since she at least could see you doing real job   


Back to the preset. Have you checked that all LEDs are correct? Arm/Automation/Transport/Loop/etc? The feedback is decoupled from functions, so even in case some button works (that I can partially check "loop sending" corresponding SysEx manually), that does not mean that LED also works (that is hard to test for me, I can just look at resulting SysExes sent, and once WAI/Mode is changed there are too many of them to check byte by byte...).

And finally there will be some pause... I will proceed with Ch17-24 as ACT controls then.