Alternative method of track to group routing

[azslow3]

Hi,

if you have downloaded, please re-download. During fixing send/input/output value changes (from AZ Controller) I have noticed I can't cache send output value.
Cakewalk notify me in case it is changed by mouse, but keep silence if I do the same from controller. And since there can be more then one controller,
it is unsafe to cache it.

[norfolkmastering]

Hi Alexey
I've been travelling for the last week so just got back home.  I will download and test over the weekend.
Can You tell me: Do I have to uninstall the old version first? or does the new version overwrite the old version?
Regards
Robert

[norfolkmastering]

Hi Alexey
I've been travelling for the last week so just got back home.  I will download and test over the weekend.
Can You tell me: Do I have to uninstall the old version first? or does the new version overwrite the old version?
Regards
Robert

Sorry, another question:  If I have to go back to the previous version, how do I preserve the multiple instances I run?
Thanks
Robert

[azslow3]

The installer overwrites existing version, so keeping the installer with version you want to revert is sufficient. Nothing special
is required to install older versions (but presets saved under newer version can be incompatible with older... well, all versions last years
are just fixes or extensions, so compatible with each other).

It is better use one version for all instances. Strange things can happened otherwise since that was never tested. When defaults are used during installation,
re-registering instances is not required.

[norfolkmastering]

Thanks Alexey.
I'll get back to you when I've carefully tested the new version with my setup.
Best regards
Robert

[norfolkmastering]

H Alexey
I downloaded the AZ test version and tested with my setup.

I found that the SysEx message for a track or bus routed to no destination is being output from AZ differently than before.

The normal output (no destination) SysEx contains the name '--- None ---'
With the new version of AZ, this name is being output as 'None'

My PIC software is all written to expect '--- None ---' so it sees this different name as an unknown destination and gets into a loop, i.e. tells Cakewalk to change unknown destination to '--- None ---' but gets name back from Cakewalk/AZ as 'None' and so this loops continues.

Could you check this please before I do any more testing.  I want to make sure the name outputs are consistent with previous AZ version.

Regards
Robert

[azslow3]

Hi Robert,

Please re-download. Should be "corrected" now.

I write that in quotas because Cakewalk is a kind of inconsistent there. It shows "--- None ---" for Sends and Strip Outputs and  "-None-" for Inputs. While in selection menu they use "None".
But I am not a big fan of renaming... even in case original naming looks wrong.

In this new version I am not asking Cakewalk for "None/Omni" (all kinds) names. So I was explicitly returning "None" and that has triggered the different.
Thanks for spotting.

Cheers,
Alexey.

[norfolkmastering]

Thanks Alexey

I downloaded the latest version and that fixed the 'None' SysEx issue.
I will test for some days and them get back to you.
Best regards
Robert

[norfolkmastering]

Hello Alexey

I did some testing of the new AZ version today.
Sadly it is still not updating the track output names when a bus name is changed.

I have attached a screen shot from MIDI-OX which monitors the output of AZ:

I test by changing the bus 2 name from 'Group 2' to 'Test 5'
The first SysEx message
240 0 1 84 101 115 116 32 53 247
is the ascii for 'Test 5'

The next SysEx message is the bus 2 output name '--- None ---'

Next are the bus 2 CCs (Fader, Pan etc)

Before I changed the Bus 2 name, I had routed Track 3 to bus 2.
The next SysEx is the Track 3 output name, still showing 'Group 2' (although the Track 3 output name on the Cakewalk screen shows 'Test 5')

So this mismatch of SysEx names is picked up by my PIC which interprets Track 3 as asking to be routed to an unknown bus.
This triggers an instruction from the PIC back to AZ to change the Track 3 destination to '--- None ---' (MIDI CH14 CC2 Value 0)
This is actioned and the final SysEx message shows the Track 3 output name as '--- None ---'

With the new software, this failure to update the track names is happening 100% of the time.

Sorry for the news!

I know you've spent a lot of time on this issue.  If you want to stop working on it then I have the work-a-round (I described before) and it is working 100% of the time, so please don't spend a lot more time on this, unless you really want to.

I'm happy to do further testing of course.

Best regards
Robert

[azslow3]

Hello Robert,

Sorry for negative results, thank you for patience

The update supposed to fix the logic, so I want it works correctly (for everyone).

I attach test preset. It probably sends wrong sysExes, so use it without connection to PIC. Just open build-in display (in the "Options" tab).
Upper cells should be bus names (1,2,3) and lower cells should be track output names (1,2,3).
SysEx slow sending is still there and name scans are even slower then that, so you should more or less notice in which order the display is updated in case
of changes. I have set Track outputs monitors priority lower then bus names, so they have to be updated (in case of bus renaming) strictly in that order.

Please test that preset updates display correctly in case: (a) track output is changed (b) bus is renamed.
The result can give me the idea from where your observation comes:
(1) I am testing on Wine/Sonar X2 (32bit), can be Cakewalk has changed something
(2) I have uploaded/you have installed not the version I have
(3) something in your current preset make things not working as expected

Regards,
Alexey.

[norfolkmastering]

Hi Alexey

I downloaded the new preset and loaded it whilst running the test AZ version 0_5r11b419M.

I did testing with a large number of physical I/O ports (32 in, 40 out) and with a smaller number of ports (8 in, 10 out)
For both sizes of ports the results were identical.

FIRST TEST
I changed the bus name and then checked to see if the track output name (for track already routed to that bus) changed to match the new bus name.

In most number of tests, the track output name did not update correctly.
In a small number of cases, the track output name did update correctly.

When the track output name did not update correctly, I see only one SysEs message output on MIDI-OX, the new bus name.
When the track output name did update correctly, I see two SysEx messages on MIDI-OX, the new bus name and the new track output name.

SECOND TEST
I changed the bus name and checked for track output name update failure.
If track output name update failed, then I routed a second track to that renamed bus.  In all cases the second track output name output correctly.

I hope this helps your investigation.  If you want me to do additional tests then please let me know and I will be happy to.

Best regards
Robert

[azslow3]

Hi Robert,

Thank you for testing. And sorry I have not tested it myself (CbB is not working under Linux/Wine, it is always a pain for me to test with it on my development setup...).

I think that is (1), Cakewalk bug. I have specially tested, Cakewalk is reporting old name. I have reported in:
https://discuss.cakewalk.com/index.php?/topic/54690-br-surface-api-strip-output-name/

I can't workaround the bug, numerical output value is just sequential number in the strip specific list, I can't deduct what is the destination. I mean theoretically in
some situations it is possible, but that will hammer Cakewalk hard and will not work in all projects.

Regards,
Alexey.

[norfolkmastering]

Hi Alexey
Thanks for the update.
I will add my voice to the topic and see if we can get a commitment to fix it.
Best regards
Robert

[azslow3]

Hi Robert.

It is interesting why your "workaround" using older AZ Controller version works... At the end it use the same calls, which in my current test return not updated name.
Sometimes several bugs together make things looking like working correctly 

Cheers,
Alexey.